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Carlos: I think the small add of 1981 has cuneiform numbers in it. It's been ages since I last read about that numbering system, but some of the cuneiform in there are numerals. Will try to find a book about mesopotamic maths in the local math library and see if I can actually find out what the numbers are.Webmaster: see here (old persian cuneiform?) and here, although they seem to be of little help...
Carlos: I quickly checked the local texts on mesopotamic maths. Indeed, some of the cuneiform in the ad seem to be numerals (a 4, a 1/2 sign), but the rest are apparently not. I don't know crap about the mesopotamic languages and alphabets, but I think this message would only make sense if you know the source for the cuneiform lines (some famous tablet?), or they are using some substitution cypher. - CarlosWebmaster: I tried matching some symbols too ... couldn't get very far. I'll keep looking for better references.
OK This is looking more like early babylonian or Assyrian, but I'll be damned if I can't get ahold of any references that match the characters in this ad.
12/06/00 clue=Bryan, I'm about 75% sure that this comes from the Code of Hammurabi. I don't know what line it is, nor do I know what it says. It is only my strong suspician that it comes from Hammurabi. However, the fact that there are numbers (including 1/2) helps to validate that suspician. Furthermore, if that is truly the source, then it may be less significant what it actually means than the fact that it comes from the CODE of Hammurabi. Cheers, mogul.
12/05/00 > Hi Jessica, > > Sorry for the incredibly late reply. I'm doubly sorry since I can't tell > you what the cuneiform mean. I'm not particularly an expert in cuneiform. > Another problem is that cuneiform was used by a lot of different people > speaking lots of different languages, so it might be quite difficult to > determine what it is saying unless we know the place it came from. > > I do think that it's not Old Persian or Ugaritic. It could be Akkadian as > that's the most commonly circulated cuneiform. It could also be Hittite, > Sumerian, Hurrian, or Elamite. > > There's a really cool Akkadian site > http://saturn.sron.ruu.nl/~jheise/akkadian/, but at this moment it seems to > be having trouble. The links page at the Sumerian site > http://www.sumerian.org/sumlinks.htm might also get you some leads.
clue: What ancient chinesse?
clue: Is Kevin asking if this could be ancient Chinese? Anyway, nope, Ancient Chinese writing was pictographic, as it still is today. This is more likely Akkadian or Sumerian (or similar), and is probably a (semi-famous) quote, as are most of the other foreign phrases found on the May Day pages.
clue: Okay, so after looking into this in much detail, my theory (even though I can't show exact proof) is that this cuneiform is not from the Code of Hammurabi at all, but from the Epic of Gilgamesh. More specifically from the Flood Narrative which very closely parallels the story of the flood from the Bible. The story starts by introducing the deeds of the hero Gilgamesh. He was one who had great knowledge and wisdom, and preserved information of the days before the flood. Gilgamesh wrote on tablets of stone all that he had done, including building the city walls of Uruk and its temple for Eanna. He was an oppressive ruler, however, which caused his subjects to cry out to the "gods" to create a nemesis to cause Gilgamesh strife. After one fight, this nemesis-Enkidu-became best friends with Gilgamesh. The two set off to win fame by going on many dangerous adventures in which Enkidu is eventually killed. Gilgamesh then determines to find immortality since he now fears death. It is upon this search that he meets Utnapishtim, the character most like the Biblical Noah. In brief, Utnapishtim had become immortal after building a ship to weather the Great Deluge that destroyed mankind. He brought all of his relatives and all species of creatures aboard the vessel. Utnapishtim released birds to find land, and the ship landed upon a mountain after the flood. The command for Utnapishtim to build the boat is remarkable: "O man of Shuruppak, son of Ubar-Tutu, tear down thy house, build a ship; abandon wealth, seek after life; scorn possessions, save thy life. Bring up the seed of all kinds of living things into the ship which thou shalt build. Let its dimensions be well measured." The cause of the flood as sent in judgment on man's sins is striking also. The eleventh tablet, line 180 reads, "Lay upon the sinner his sin; lay upon the transgressor his transgression." A study of these parallels to Genesis 6-9, as well as the many others, demonstrate the non-coincidental nature of these similarities. The rest of the Epic, which dates back to possibly third millennium B.C., contains little of value for Christians, since it concerns typical polytheistic myths associated with the pagan peoples of the time. However, some Christians have studied the ideas of creation and the afterlife presented in the Epic. Even secular scholars have recognized the parallels between the Babylonian, Phoenician, and Hebrew accounts, although not all are willing to label the connections as anything more than shared mythology. See the tablet of the Flood Narrative here (as you can tell, it's not particularly easy to read the cuneiform in this picture): http://www.stolaf.edu/people/kchanson/gilgtab.html
clue: Okay, I'll give it a go... In the top line, it appears that the first three are the numbers one and eleven 111. The second set appear to be the numbers 8 and 10, so the long would be 111.08.10. The next appears to be the number 32 then 2 or 1 and 1 and the tee looking characters is actually 1/2 or 05... so lat is either 32.02.05 or 32.11.05. The very last character appears to be an "i" if that makes any sense. Anyway, if you put those coordinates in, in both cases you end up in Tucson. See for yourself:http://www.mytopo.com/searchgeo.cfm
clue: Thompson, can you tell us how you came to the conclusion which numbers these represent? Most information I have found regarding Babylonian and Sumerian number systems show symbols representing single units, and symbols representing tens. See some examples here: http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/HistTopics/Babylonian_numerals.html Another excellent source for learning about the cuneiform writing system is the one provided by the webmaster: "resource 1". It shows that five basic orientations are found in cuneiform. One that it doesn't show, nor have I found it elsewhere, is the first symbol on the top row, where the wedges point diagonally down to the left. If I find more information on this, I will send an update.
clue: I wholeheartedly agree with Jessica's remarks of 1.26.02, especially as regards the slant of the first character in the message. I've looked at many, many samples of cuneiform, and have yet to see something similar to that character. I even wrote Prof. Heise (referenced in Resource 1, above) and asked him to take a look at this sample, but I received no reply.
name: Me I agree that it looks like Late Assyrian (c. 650 BC) form of cuneiform. Possible numbers (common forms): Fourth group (of six) in first line [4:1]: 4 (or: 1/4 - the Babylonians were not specific) [5:1]: 1/2 (half) [4:2]: 4 [3:2] is not how the number three would most often have been written, however, it is the way of the 'Old Persian' script so there may be some mixture (the rest does not seem to fit Old Persian...). The "other way around", i.e. with the single long vertical followed by the two on top of each other, it would have been 'a' - water.
Someone pointed this out to me, but it doesn't look like Ugaritic...
The Ugaritic script, like its Akkadian cousin, is written left to right. This is like English but the opposite of Hebrew which is written right to left. "
God was smiling on me today... This unbelivably obscure snippet comes from the office paperwork of a 2000BC Sumerian Temple. It translates as "its fish:(ca. 1750 liters), altogether (the fish): (ca. 2584 liters)" The source is Haverford Library Collection of Cuneiform Tablets or Documents from the Temple Archives of Telloh, Part I, Philadelphia - London 1905 which has been digitized and can be seen at http://cdli.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/Pget.pl?P=P109886.http://cdli.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/Pget.pl?P=P109886
-hance you win the award, that is an amazing @#%^ing find - Comparison below:
And those coordinates (17.50, 25.84) are in Sudan, NW of Khartoum. Not a clue for this page necessarily, but De Rebus is a South African attorneys journal.
Mike C: 07.06.2004
Some more comments on the August 24, 1981 "cuneiform ad". I've done some more investigating and there are a number of things that I want to point out. 1.The 1905 reference is to drawings of the tablets and not transliterations or translations. Those were first published in 1990, eight years after this ad. The 1990 transliteration of this tablet is given on the cdli link with the image of the tablet. The transliterated numbers or pen strokes might have some info, but I doubt if they were expecting someone to translate this, unless it was an expert. 2. In the translation of cuneiform the first step is a transliteration, which is the conversion of the symbols into syllables, representative of the spoken language. I think the written languages of the ancient middle east changed/varied more that the spoken ones, so the "spoken" ones make better starting points for an X to english dictionary. There are several of these dictionaries. One that would be applicable to this tablet is the Chicago Assyrian Dictionary, which was recently pointed out to Bryan by the freaks. The CAD is a project of the Oriental Institute, part of the University of Chicago, with offices in "The Loop". At some point in time, the Haverford Library collection was transferred to the Oriental Institute, who now own the particular tablet this comes from. The man who published the images, George A. Barton has ties to U of Chicago, Univ. of Pennsylvania (with the Viam Inveniemus aut Faciemus arch), Harvard (PhD from there) and Bryn Mawr. He was born 1859, died 1942. His work has had an impact on pre christian religious/biblical research. 3.The transliteration gives the numbers as 5 4 1 in the first row and 8 3 4 in the second. the 1 in the first row uses the same symbol that is used for 1/2 (the first and most easily recognized symbol in my attempt to match patterns). While they used a sexagesimal (base 60, the same as our degrees, minutes, seconds) math, these don't fit into that system because they come with their own units. The double cross symbol at the end of both rows is a gur which is a dry volume measure( like our bushel) equal to about 300 liters (for volume 1 liter is 1 decimeter cubed). In the same way our gallon can be divided into quarts and pints a gur can be divided into 5 barigs ( 60 liter)and a barig into 6 ban2 (10liter). So 5 gur+ 4 barig + 1 ban2 = 1750 liters. 4. Maybe 541/2834 was a useful phone number in 1981? Its out of service now. Or maybe it is a long/lat.
if the actual translation and not simply the source mean anything, then we are missing something. okat, its fish, 1750 liters (and these are apparently americans, old school. why would they use liters if translating themselves?) and altogether a larger amount. i take this as a shipment of fish in something, water, or sauce, possibly live fish. fish going where, and why? is this knowable?
Glad to see the cuneiform has been tracked down, what a find! Well done Mike. I guess since, as Mike has said, the text itself wasn't translated until 1990, that is going to render the precise meaning irrelevant. I would guess, however, that the nature of what was in the cuneiform tablet from which this came may already have been roughly known. I gather it is from the Temple Archives of Telloh and it appears to be an inventory of some kind, perhaps of goods rendered to the temple or produce of the temple's estates. If it were produce rendered as offerings or tribute to the temple then we could perhaps interpret this as an analogy for the nature (as they would see it) of the project that they were about to embark on 'soon'..
The Orphanage / 12.29.2004
name: U Bud clue: Jes a thougt fer ol Bry--somebody say "since the text wasn't translated until 1990"--bad logic. We dig all U contributors an don't mean no bad vibes fer nobody--but a shitload a people been reading Sumerian fer generations. Jes gotta hab de skill an de aKcess ta de tablets. All us Freaks aint locked up all de time. Some a us even kain read write n cipher--an got dem liddle piecez a paper dat gib aKcess to private collekshunz. Dis make a good point--ebybuddy an de outside figger a Freak iz a total OUTSIDER. God willin, dey keep thinkin dat way until THE GREAT DAY.
Hance - this message was sent immediately after freaks#174 from an IP in Mexico.
Amazing what information the odd dumb comment can elicit. Cheers Ubud :) Okay, I guess we can take it as confirmed that they had a translation now. Anon's clue, pointing to a location NW of Khartoum in Sudan tallies with info from other announcements IIRC - that location (at least general location, need to check) has come up before. They insist on Continental European connections, so their use of litres (if that is the case) would not be problematic. Main thing I was gonna post - the text talks about 'fish' - the fish being a symbol used by the early Christians, notably when they had to be secretive during their persecution by the Roman authorities. Point is - these early announements don't reference Christianity - but it is one of the main themes running through all the communications and through the project in general after this first series. This could, in one respect, be a signal that after this 'introductory series' (as I see it) they have decided switch from using Communism to Christianity as a dominant theme - if they want to maintain any level of secrecy this would be a sensible move when working in the USA, far less likely to draw unwanted attention I guess. This then begs the question, as to whether their prevailing ideology might not indeed be Communist, and the Christianity that pervades their communications simply a guise and a source of material with which to weave their code - or perhaps they follow neither and the two ideologies represented a choice of guises that were suitable covers for the agenda. The concept of the 'Final Judgement' could be compared in a way to the Communist goal of 'Revolution', either might be termed a 'Great Day' by their proponents and represent a point of sweeping change where an old order is swept away and something else put in place. Back to the fish symbol - the image of early Christians working in secrecy in the Roman Empire leaving little symbols to communicate to their brethren - it may be possible to see the situation and activities of the early Christians as analogous in *some* respects to 'their' activities, and/or intentions.
With reference to the comment made by "Anon" on 07.02.2004 <<"And those coordinates (17.50, 25.84) are in Sudan, NW of Khartoum. Not a clue for this page necessarily, but De Rebus is a South African attorneys journal.">> This may be really obvious but I haven't noticed it mentioned anywhere else... re·bus n 1. a puzzle in which the syllables of words and names are represented either by pictures of things that sound the same, or by letters 2. a heraldic emblem showing a picture that represents the name of the bearer, for example, a picture of a lion for somebody named Lyon . Jamie (It's been a while!)
near a terminal 06.27.2005
Jamie should get some kind of prize for knowing that about South Africa. Who in their right mind would look for secet messages in a shyster journal? I never would and I don't think any normal law enforcement people like the CIA or FBI or M5 or whatever would look there either.
Jay C. 09.21.2005
It's cuneiform. Might be Sumerian, Babylonian or Hittite. I only recognize the forms. The wedge shape (cuneus) gives it away. I'm wondering if the "Chinese" might be a later form of the same thing.
Its cuniform text. Babylonian. BC.
August 24th (date of announcement) - possibly chosen to mark the anniversary of the completion of the printing of the Gutenberg Bible in 1456, although there are a number of anniversaries on this date which might be of interest to the Freaks including The St. Bartholomew's Day Massacre took place on August 24th (mass slaughter of French Protestants) in 1572.
D. Thomasson 03.31.2006
Mike's posting on 06.24.2004 points out that the cuneiform translation in the announcement translates to: Its fish: (ca. 1750 liters) The fish: (ca. 2584 liters) Add 1750 + 2584 to get 4334. Multiply each of the digits (4*3*3*4) to get 144 (12x12). 144 and 12 are key numbers used throughout the ADW announcements. Now factorialize the individual digits of 4334 (4!+3!+3!+4!) and add them together to get 60. 60 is used in the announcements to reflect time, degrees, angles, and possibly other items. I'm leaning towards the number 144 being the KEY message in this announcement. Search the Internet for information about 144 or 144,000, the New Kingdom, or the coming of the New Jerusalem, hence the word "Soon" at the end of the announcement. The Greek word for elect is "He Ekloge" which adds up to 144. Also, a disciple is known as "lamed" from which the word Talmud comes from. Lamed is also the 12th letter of the Hebrew alphabet. 12 disciples are also 12 lameds, or 12 x 12 = 144. To add to that, the 144,000 is mentioned in Revelation chapters 7 and 14. Also, the 12th Fibonacci number is 144. Here are a couple URLs to get you started:http://www.biblewheel.com/GR/GR_144.asp
clue: From my previous post about 1750 + 2584 = 4334, I mention that 4*3*3*4 = 144. 4334 also relates to Revelation 7 and 14. Break down the number to 4+3=7 and 3+4=7. Also, 7+7=14.
What about the top of the ad? Where it says nailed Francona at the plate. career. I belive he is reffering to Francis Farcona a baseball player, hence nailed at the plate part. But why is it out of the box? Perhaps out of the batting box? Or something of that sort. I feel like im grasping at staws =P
On the Sergei question about Franconia--wasn't that actually done by the webmaster's scan? Of course Sergei may mean that the webmaster is in on the consipiracy but I've always believed that anyway. I think most of us do. On the Sumerian, the transltteration wasn't available to the public in general until 1991 about a decade atter this ad or announcement; so we know a number of things by simple inference. The two biggest in my opinion are that the Freaks are deeply entrenched in the academic world and there is no way without much time and money they could have accessed this information long prior to the Internet. Even if a rudimentary search engine existed for Internet predecessors this exceedingly obscure Sumerian would not have been posted anywhere. There may be a lone mad man behind all this but no detective would ever believe that theory.
Preterite Pete 01.11.2006
I have chastized the numerologists here before for what I think is the failure to recognize that you can find anything you like in a given series of numbers, especially if you start resorting to arbitrary base shifts and such. What I'm going to suggest here might very well fall under that category. Mike C. demonstrated that this is photocopied from George A. Barton's HLC: Temple Archives of Telloh. I strongly suspect that this one was photocopied from the SMU or Dallas Theological Seminary copy (Worldcat--the database, not The Daily Wildcat) will let you know that the U of Arizona doesn't own these books). According to the UCLA cuneiform collection, it comes from vol. 7, plate 54, col 2, rows 19-20. The very early annoucements, as far as I can determine, are meant to intrigue, perhaps demonstrate some purpose, and encode the time of the next announcement. The next one that doesn't follow the Mayday pattern is 4/19/83. Twenty months ahead, the nineteenth day. I wonder how many students, faculty, staff, and general residents of Tuscon in 1981 could have looked at this and sight-translated it from memory, or from the available library sources (or from their own personal copies). As for the numbers themselves, presuming they could be transliterated (I suspect that Barton's work does this itself, though I've only examined brief articles on similar topics he published around the same time) 541 834 =1(5+4)83 4 is the time of the first non-regular annoucement (with 19, the row number being its date of publication). Juls's remarks about the fish symbolism also seem apt here.
Once again I have been drawn in to this game. see(http://www.maydaymystery.org/mayday/texts/08-may1.html) I hope to proceed through each clue and add a few nuggets. Kabbalah holds many clues, it describes the mathematical journey to Heaven, a real historical place on Earth, the Pyramids and the Egyptian Book of the Dead describe the same journey through the 12 Gates of the Duat. There are 12 'gates' in a 3-4-5 triangle and 42 judges in the 'Underworld'. The name of God of 42 letters has a gematria value of 5163. Edinburgh, Scotland, is 4/42nds west and 3/42nds north of the Great Pyramid of Giza. The mathematical codes built into the Giza plateau show the way, it is the Biblical Jerusalem, I shit you not, but I have been working at this for 20 years and I know I am right. History is a lie, every piece of written history before 350 ad is based in Britain and Ireland, ALL OF IT. Greeks, Romans, Persians, Ægyptians and Iudeans all were in Scotland. Edinburgh is Jerusalem, that is the secret kept from you. So for now, accept that you are dealing with very clever people whose insight into the truth would overwhelm you and here is the first solution. 541 is the gematria value of the word ISRAEL 834 is the gematria value of 'transiens super prevaricatione' (Rise above deceit) These references can be found in Aleister Crowley's book Sepher Sephiroth and 'Godwins Cabalistic Encyclopedia'. A half (1/2) of 834 is 417 - Noah's Ark. This secret was held by the Ægyptians - the Gypsies of Galloway, Scotland. Search David MacRitchie on Gypsies in Amazon. I have to go now. More clues on the next clue to follow. Gnower, still here in the Wilderness
near a terminal 08.30.2010
Re: Gnower and his/her/their interessting comments. Can't cite the dates of the various communications but I think the Freaks have confirmed that they make recourse to the Kabbalah on occasion. You'll have to check the cites or somebody should check them but it seems like the Freaks also indicated that they find the Kabbalah useful. Don't think they ever said they believed in the Kabbalah or saw it as a source of truth.
(none provided) 10/24/2014
Still think SR/CL refers to status report/certified location: The 1750 might refer to a street location near the Oriental Institute of the University of Chicago, and the 2584 might refer to the charity code of the Senior Service Association for the University of Chicago. All the fish I would think probably is a Christian reference, perhaps referring to themselves as 'the fish', i.e. repressed masses/the working class.
Just a wild thought, but since the Babylonians are the oldest known source for the zodiac, and "the fish" symbolized Pisces (and the age of Pisces) perhaps this is referring to the coming of the next age (Aquarius) "soon"?
New to the site and I'm intrigued. I was guided to the website by the first MM clue I viewed; Leitmotiv Uzamcolo on June 19, 2013. I think that the comment by Jessica on 01/26/02 should be looked at in greater detail. She made a link to the Epic of Gilgamesh's flood story. As you all probably know by know, Uzamcolo Zulu for flood. I also find it interesting that references to South Africa come up since the Zulu are located in Southern Africa.
These earlier clues I feel like all run together. Tell where and when a meeting will take place. I also feel like since this is being published in a college paper that colleges are linked together in a big way. Take a look at this website referring to Map published in 1974 by Thomas g magner from/for Penn state. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1540-4781.1974.tb05130.x/abstract If you look up Penn state you will see the coat of arms/logo there is a "fish" on it. Check out Wikipedia on Penn state. I feel like this whole this is very religious based. Earlier clues seem to show where and when meeting were tAking place and what they were going to discuss . The later more complicated clues make me feel like they may still meet occasionally, but they also have an underground website that if we can figure out the clues we'd be able to see everything this group is discussing/meeting about. -ramblings from a bored humanoid.
bhance: FWIW we've never found any conclusive proof that these ads relaetd to any other schools. UofA only. And I don't see a map at the wiley.com link?
The link was not to show a map, but show a MAO reference.
Re:Mike c, we can find out who had the phone number 541 2834 in 1981. We would need to check criss cross directories from 1981. These would only be available locally probably at the main branch of the Tuscon public library local history section or the local historical society. I do not have access to either of these someone locally would need to check.
Anyway I tried doing some transliteration work on this and this was the results of my attempt: Line 1: ?*.? 5(AŠ) ZA.MAŠ.GUR Line 2: ? 8(AŠ) A ZA SILA(3) GUR *Proposed translit: Line 1: H̬A.ŠIM 5 ZA.MAŠ.GUR Line 2: ŠAR 8 A ZA SILA GUR I have a proposed translation because I can't seem to find anything resembling the ? symbols, they seem to look like the proposed symbols missing a few parts. This is probably sumerian, since the result doesn't look like akkadian to me. I'm not knowledgeable in Sumerian, so I posted my findings on a discord server for dead languages. I'll be honest, I'm not as good with cuneiform as I am with the spoken language of akkadian, so I'm not sure how reliable my transliteration is. Šalām elīkunu! (Peace to you in Akkadian) -EngiduN. Sorata 12/30/2020
The symbols displayed are bababylonian cuniform numbers for the most part, if not entirely. All of the symbols used are definitely babylonian. They work similarly to roman numerals.JB 12/30/2021
Soon - divine completeness which is a theme running through all MDM announcements and combines well with SR/CL which = 7